Monday, September 29, 2008

12 Noon Monday The Bailout Battle Continues:First Vote planned at 1 PM


So here it is almost noon...and Things are not looking great...World Markets are reacting...all over, Asia to Russia to Europe.
The Repercussions have started....as we knew they would,....the Question is How bad is this..and can we in America do anything to stop this these tidal waves ?....Would the Bailout Package work as a Bandaid on this Hemorrhage ......I don't know...At this point I am just an Observer...Watching to see what happens next....I will post more during the Day.

Do read Paul Krugman's 3am Phone Call.

2 PM House Voted, and the Intervention Bill failed and the market did indeed plunge.

4 PM Update:
Market plunged 748 points.....10372.54......The Repugs are blaming the Dems....and Obama spoke about the issue, McCoot has been strangely quiet...( maybe he is planning his next suspension).

FINAL NUMBERS:
LATIMES:Los Angeles Times | September 29. 2008 | 1:16 p.m. PDT
Stocks tumble as bailout plan fails in House.The Dow Jones industrials plunged more than 700 points....777 Points — the largest point drop EVER — after the failure of the financial bailout plan in the House.In Other News: The House has decided to reconvene Thursday after the markets nosedive on bailout defeat, the Associated Press reports.

8PM:::
Andrew Sullivan really nails it in GOP KILLED IT.

UPDATE AS OF 5PM SEPT 30TH,
Here is the update of the Bank Situation as of tonight it is up to 1.75, that is better than Monday. But things are still shaky, and this article also explains that 3 other banks are wavering...

On the HomeFront:::
More about National City For Ohio Folks to follow.Say a little prayer for 6-6 and me....This is my landlord's bank...in January 2007 I moved because our Previous Landlord got foreclosed ( we had been living in our Downtown Loft that we loved behind Jacob's Field). So in the Middle of winter, I went searching for a place, in snow and ice,....and found this battered old house, it was Ten Below Zero, but I got us all moved in. I negotiated the rent and Fixed Every Blessed Inch of it, the Floors, the broken stairs, the holes in the walls, the pee stained walls,fixed up the porch. I even painted the Kitchen Floor Black and white....I made it a Home...And this past winter he finally fixed the Heat....It has been nice to have a dining room and here is the Cat Chair....and yeah , I even made a garden out back......but I will go collect boxes today and pray that I don't need to use them, (but here in Ohio if your landlord gets foreclosed, you have 3 days to be out)...I hope and pray that 6-6 and I can stay here until he goes to Film School Next year,(we were planning to stay until then)...and that we get to use that new Heater....I worry about everyone...getting through this,...I really do....Home is a Precious Thing....

45 comments:

enigma4ever said...

Quick note- I heard over the weekend people are having trouble loading the page and that maybe the banner is a problem..please let me know- I need more feedback....enigma4ever@earthlink.net....thanks....

HelenWheels said...

I so hope you will be safe & sound & not have to move!! Gawd. 3 days? That doesn't sound right! Can't you contest it? 3 days is crazy...that's just wrong.

I will keep you in my thoughts & send positive messages out into the universe on your & 6-6's behalf.

All I'm seeing in the press is how BAD the bailout is, that Paulson pulled the 700 billion number out of his ass, and that if it gets voted in, it will be the final payout to the shrubco & its cronies, and the final looting of our country.

HelenWheels said...

Michael Moore sent out an email tying the crash to healthcare... a good read, interesting take. He's the one who said Paulson pulled the $700 billion out of his ass, btw.

Jackie said...

Sending all hopes and good thoughts to you. Bless you for making a house a home.

I think of - and have no ability to wrap my mind around their numbers - all those people out there who don't know if they will have a home in the coming days and weeks and months.

This is all such a nightmare. I think part of me can't believe this is happening.

enigma4ever said...

Jackie::
I know me...me too..I am so worried , not just about me...about millions of people..I just mentioned our situation,I hope I don't sound selfish, because to be honest...I am worried and I would rather not go through it alone...I went through January 2007 alone..and was so humiliated about it and I did not tell people until it was ALL over...
But I know so many people are in this boat with me...this should not be happening and there are people that are responsible for doing this....

Helen:::
thank you...I know 6-6 and I always get through things ..you know we have moved around the country...over and over..I guess that makes us more patriotic right? yeah the 3 day Law of Ohio Stinks...to high heaven...there are people looking into fighting it...as much as I grumble about our home...the flooded basement,....the battered crooked stairs..it is HOME...and 6-6 loves it...


VOTE::: ( very very tight...)
Yea....188....DEMS 119...Repugs...72
Nays...204......Dems 67....Repugs 105


{{cspan needs a bigger screen- this is killing my eyes...))

I will post the FInal totals below...

enigma4ever said...

Final vote::: HR 3997 Financial Markets Bill

Yea::::205
DEM::139
Repug:::65

Nay::::228
DEM:::95
Repug:::133


( oral vote it passed- but written vote it looks like it is not going to pass...2 have not voted.)

HelenWheels said...

I can't believe the dems are in favor of this. From what I'm hearing, it's a hand-out to the shrub & wallstreet. What gives? Why did they give themselves so little time to fix something that took years in the making? It just seems like more knee-jerk, rash bullshit like the rushes to war. I am feeling very frightened by this too-quick fix.

HelenWheels said...

Might be a good thing that it didn't pass. What do you think?!

MandT said...

We are with you--send our strongest vibes. There is absolutely nothing more scary than house insecurity, especially one as colorful and magical as yours. Hey, let's create a box city in front of the White House or the Smithsonian Mall! What worked for the AIDS quilt might drive home what 'homeless' means.

D.K. Raed said...

WOW! Watching the vote live. As soon as the nays exceeded the yays, the DOW started plummeting! I saw it jump down from 300 to 500 then to 670 before it starts backing back up. Ali Velshi said it was down 705 before backing off. THIS IS SCARY! And the world does NOT care about the detail of the bailout, they just want us to pass something that will free up money. We care & we need to get it right, but this is gut-wrenching.

Your front page has been loading slow, E. Not bad, but slow. I chalked it up to increased blog traffic due to all this turmoil. I'm keeping good thoughts about your landlord, that he'll be able to work something out. Just because his bank is in trouble does not mean his properties are being foreclosed.

D.K. Raed said...

Boehner just said it WOULD have passed except that Pelosi got up & gave a speach first that upset them (who knew they were so emotionally delicate?). I didn't see her speech. What could she have said? Or is Boehner just plain nutz, looking for a way he can sit on both sides of the fence?

D.K. Raed said...

Oh & while all the reps are trying to explain what happened today, the DOW is settling down at about a 500-pt decline. Yes, they are saying Pelosi gave a "poison speech". Wonder what she said?

enigma4ever said...

DK::
you are right there was too much stuff in it...the 100B for Bush???? grrrrr.....I think something needed to be passed- something that says it looks like there is some kind of intervention.......I saw her speech- I did not think it was a big deal- I also saw Boehner bashing it and said it was a Mud Sandwich....

I don't think Pelosi knew the reality of WHO was really voting...Boehner is a manipulative shit...
Sorry- But I watch him all the time...

About the landlord...he was having trouble- got all his properties aprraised in the spring and he told me about the situation and that he needed a loan...and our property was used to get the loan..BUT I also have had 2 different Chinese people stop by and ask if I am a good tenant- which worries me as they are shopping and buying up properites in my hood- they bring buses and minivans through with them "shopping"....I just know he was and is having trouble..he told me..even joked he could not have gotten me the heater this winter...ce la vie...

I went out and got boxes and wrote down numbers....we'll see what happens....quite a few landlords on this street have already been foreclosed....it's just a reality of the situation...

enigma4ever said...

Mandt:::
ooops...forgot to finish that response...yeah...I think we need tent cities there...yeah......I don't know what to do...the Quilt was powerful- I worked on a bunch of squares....I would love to see the whole thing someday..I have heard there is no space big enough now- that it would not fit on the lawn....

About the Bailout...I think that it is a mess...there was alot of it I did not support...and I did think Dodd's plan was solid...I do think we need some sort of Intervention for the regular people but also the world to see...there is more at stake I think then most of us know or understand....there were parts of it I don't and didn't like - of the revised version...I agree with Paul Krugman above.....( I don't always agree with him- but on this issue and economics he is wise)...

I am watching CNBC....

HelenWheels said...

BONER is a crybaby drunk, what the hell does that freak know!

Sorry, just had to chime in....

HelenWheels said...

Pelosi's an asshole too...

OMG, is she going to harm the dems' races by being an idiot (yet again)?

enigma4ever said...

Helen::
you know how I feel about Pelosi...oye...How did Boxer vote..I trust her...Waxman did indeed vote for it...I don't think her speech was a big deal- his was shittty...and yes, Boehner is I think playing games....
I would also like to hear Dodd on the new bill too...

HEY ALL::
I reloaded a different photo on the banner- it is not that big - I think my traffic is up..actually I know it is.....I am having trouble getting on too...I don't know what to do - if anyone has any ideas let me know...

HelenWheels said...

OK is BONER drunk here where he cries? OT I know, but I couldn't resist. This cracks me up SO MUCH!! Let's see if he cries over the bailout bill too!

Oh and I adore Barbara Boxer. I'd also like to know how she voted, but it'll probably be in my email w/in the hour (she's good that way).

Hairball said...

Enigma,
I'm sending up thoughts and prayers about your housing situation.

Dean Wormer said...

Fine. Dems should toss this "compromise" bill and introduce something punitive towards CEOs and very progressive. If the republicans aren't going to be grown-ups then screw em.

X. Dell said...

(1) Kudos on your handiwork. The walls hardly looked pee-stained at all, now.

(2) I appreciate the fact that misfeasance and/or malfeasance on the part of financial institutions impacted your life in a concrete and negative way. That's a good thing to keep in mind, always.

(3) I thought I would share this with you. It's about some of the fundamental questions about the baiout and the media surrounding the issue.

(4) I am having a bit of difficulty loading your page. Then again,I'm on an ancient Pentium III machine.

enigma4ever said...

HairBall::
thank you.....It will be okay..whatever happens it will be okay...I just wanted to be honest that I am worried...and also that I know there are millions of other families going through the same thing...Oh, real quick- the GAO link I had for you about the retirement funds is not working- I am looking for a better link for you ( email me if you can so I can send directly to you - okay ?)

Dean::
You read my mind- I agree..Screw 'm, the repugs were and are playing games...for their own sake...but this is going to backfire on them..because they are trying to cater to their lobbyists...we all know it...

Helen::
ahhh you had to go there...oye...oh well..he is an embarrassment...

enigma4ever said...

Xdell::
ahh thank you...I got this house after college students had destroyed it...I think they had parties and hence the walls special feature...yuck...But now they are clean and painted every last inch of this house....it is an 1894- it was ready for someone to be nice to it....oh well..everywhere we have ever lived...has been Home...I hope that my landlord did the right thing and worked on that situation..

Now onto other issues...I did not like the NEW version the 106 page version was full of gifts and the 100 Billion for Bush...I think the Dodd plan was more favorable to us...real people ....Please know this I don't think the Wallst CEO's deserve any relief...my gut says that this mess is worse than we all know...and now that there are global repercussions...I am worried...I have many more questions than answers....the bottemline it is not a good intervention bill- and worse than that..I think Intervention might be too little too late....and will not help all of us that is what I am worried about....

I think we will enter a Depression...we are way past the "R" word....I am not saying that to fearmonger..I think that is just the truth of it...the reality.

I will read your link...I am sorry about the page loading slow- I am having trouble figuring it out...I will keep working on it...

enigma4ever said...

On Shuster, the down is down 777 points....the Biggest Number Drop in the History of the Market....

McCain's people " the Repug feelings were hurt and they were originally "excluded " from the process...

Shuster is confronting Eakins about how McCain and Liebermann eating at a Posh Resturante , while everyone else was working in DC eating sandwiches in their offices...and working...

McCain did NOT deliver ANY repug votes...Eakins is saying that McCain came through ( really ???)

HelenWheels said...

SIMPLY unbelievable. Is Caesar fiddling while Rome burns... AGAIn? Remember the b-day cake during Katrina? Shit he really IS the shrub, only meaner, isnt' he?

enigma4ever said...

yeah...he really is just a mean old man...and gee- No Cake this time...

HelenWheels said...

Uh... thanks everyone for not correcting me that Boxer is a senator... sheeesh my brain is mush today!! Holy crap. LOL!

enigma4ever said...

I made the same mistake- and yes, my brain is also oatmeal at this point...got no sleep...sorry...

HelenWheels said...

I don't even have that excuse. I got sleep.

I'd like to drop-kick McLame now for being such a rotten horrible person. Really, I'm so disgusted.

HelenWheels said...

OK here's what I'm confused about. Was Pelosi saying this bill should NOT have been voted for? And are dems considering the fact that most of them voted FOR it a good thing? I thought most consituents (us) opposed it? I'm getting so confused...

D.K. Raed said...

Pelosi was saying that the bill should be passed. What pissed off the repugs was that she had the audacity to bring up who is responsible for the series of events that led to where we are today. So she laid it at Bush's doorstep, which is too close for comfort for the repugs. THE TRUTH HURT THEIR FEELINGS!

BTW, don't forget out the outset when Paulson plan's was thrust out, the congressional Dems said they were NOT going to pass anything without majority repub support. They've been down that path before.

The stock trading volume today was also historical -- over 2Billion shares. About 50mill were side-ways or gains. WOW. This is a huge volume of shares sold at a loss!

HelenWheels said...

Thanks for 'splainin' it to me, DK! I don't get, though, why this looks bad for rethugs IF the bailout isn't a good plan, since it's shrub's plan I don't trust it, and WHY are the dems backing the shrub's plan??!?

enigma4ever said...

DK is an excellant Splainer ;-)

This is all mindbogging.....they are not really supporting Bush's plan - they are supporting an Intervention...they do have to DO Something...but I am not convinced this was the best plan..I wish it was more progressive and more resrictive of the Wallstreet CEO's...and 100 B for Bush NO WAY....and wished it protected more homeowners...

I listened to Waxman and he presented some interesting points...

D.K. Raed said...

Oh Helen, I'm not sure anyone can really explain what went down. The original Paulson bailout idea sucked. Today's house plan had some important concessions for taxpayers & oversight. It wasn't perfect, but it would've calmed the international market. There will never be a perfect way to make things right that should never have reached this point.

The Dems aren't backing Shrub, but they understood the urgency of doing something & used Paulson's ideas as a starting point for their own plan. I want to see what the Senate comes up with. I'm unclear if they need to wait for the House to send them a bill first, or if they can initiate their own & send it to the House.

enigma4ever said...

DK::
Well, they had Dodds plan - so the next couple of days will show what is what...I love how you explain this...better than me..thanks

D.K. Raed said...

Read Robert Borosage in HuffPost today "After the Revolt against Wall Street". If I could link it in this comment, I would (but we all know I am a link idiot).

E, I cannot explain anything, only offer observations! Ron Suskind pointed out today that the repubs are jumping ship on Bush just like they did in Nixon's final days. We all understood what was happening back then & that's why Gerry Ford was never elected. Let's hope as a country we haven't lost so many brain cells since then that we can't see why Obama NEEDS to be elected now.

Listening to McC today was an affront to reason. He is STILL blaming the sins of deregulation on Obama, STILL saying Obama wants to raise taxes on those making $42K, STILL saying he can reach across the aisle & Obama can't.

And just to cheer you up, Gerald Posner just Huff-posted a tidbit of conversation he had with Ross Perot in 1995 when Perot was investigating people he hated. He hated McCain because McC stopped the MIA bill & Perot thought some MIA's might still be alive. Perot told Posner that McCain had a HUGE gambling problem & that Cindy had bailed him out many times & he wondered if McCain might've used his senatorial position to repay some of his debts! This guy canNOT be president!

Hairball said...

Meanwhile in Palin news....

Palin's parents pan media
Tell Early Show's Harry Smith Their Daughter Is Ready To Be President
http://tinyurl.com/43gnfc

Exclusive: McCain, Palin Answer Critics
Katie Couric Asks Palin If She Contradicted McCain On Pakistan And Her Response To GOP Criticism
http://tinyurl.com/4lwg4s

HelenWheels said...

Oh thanks now it makes more sense to me. Enigma can tell you, I"m a self-professed economic idiot. It's not pretty, but it's true.

enigma4ever said...

Helen::
you are not an idiot...how many of us studied the Depression? ( other than Paulson...oye)

Hairball::
thanks friend,...I did indeed post the McCain Palin Couric Interview...ouch....hehe....good finds...I don't know if I can bear to post her parents....urghhhh...

DK:::
you are just about Brilliant..you should know that - because you explain things in ENGLISH...I am so grateful..it makes sense I find myself sitting here nodding ....thank you....
( and yeah...Jumping ship on Nixon...so true...)

Fran said...

Helen wrote: ll I'm seeing in the press is how BAD the bailout is, that Paulson pulled the 700 billion number out of his ass, and that if it gets voted in, it will be the final payout to the shrubco & its cronies, and the final looting of our country.

Oh my! I wish this would be the final payout, but I fear we are just going to keep paying & paying.
If it is the last payout to the shrub... it is only be default because his term will be over in Jan.(112 days to be exact!).

I would like to see Paulson fired- him & his total immunity offer?

I do feel like this is some kind of Maffia scene-- him making us offers we can;t refuse.

I favor a panel of Economic poobahs non politicians from all spectrums of the political realms, to come together put a well thought out plan that is not wrought with loopholes and language that can be tweaked by Wall Street Sharks.

Obviously something must be done, but what how needs to be put together thoughtfully, not in a halfbaked congressional playground tussle.

Sorry but Congress has not been awardwinning keepers of the purse either, so I'm not feeling comfortable with them being "the deciders" either.
Get some people in there who know what they are talking about, and are not politically posturing, but have extensive knowledge on economics & some kind of proven track record.

Fran said...

E~ I am sorry to hear this latest situation is hitting too close to home & having that fear.
You are not just watching this historic nightmare, you are feeling like you are on the front lines of it.
I hope all works out well.
I hope you don't have to move until you are ready to move- your choice.

I hope we don't have to start up an Enigma Bailout emergency moving fund.(Don't doubt that your cyber pals just might do that, if need be.)

One day at a time.

HelenWheels said...

I second that, Fran! And thanks for your input. This dilemma makes my head spin! CRAZY!

enigma4ever said...

thanks Fran for saying that...I really appreciate that...I actually had not thought of that....yet...I did go get phone numbers of other places to live and boxes today...I think I have to be practical...I mean he did talk to me and tell me things are not good...I am just hoping that things got sorted out..

but you just don't know...not in these times...I live so frugally I can not believe I would go through this again...

on another level I just think that it is easier to just tell it like it is...even if it is close to home...I am trying to be calm about it...

Helen:::
thanks ...you all are the best...It is good to just know you are out there...

Fran said...

This is classic Bush stuff- wait until something is in full crisis/catastrophe mode before starting to think about doing something.

Come on someone in the higher level of the Bush Cabinet had to have told him what was going on.....

was he just hoping it would all hold together until after the election?

Figures he'd just walk off & leave the country in ruins.... while wearing a fricking flag lapel pin- no less.

It is smart of you to kind of start putting things together, maybe it will be Murphy's law, if you have it together, you won't need it.

Let's hope.

enigma4ever said...

thanks Fran...
yeah I hope I don't need it ...

About Bush ya know I just don't know...I mean how could he have NOT known ?? I think he was hoping it would not crash until he was out the door...he looks pissed off at these press conferences the past week....but not surprized...